The religious evolutionist, an uneasy combination: “Of course the earth couldn’t have been created in 7 of our days. A day for God must be much longer.”
Okay, why not? There is evidence that our year wasn’t always the same length it is now, after-all. Heck, we could even be considering galactic time segments as our part of the galaxy orbits the central singularity. So again, why not?
The Islamist trying to make a very old tradition sound scientific to Westerners: “The woman must cover her hair around strange men because otherwise the pheromones radiating from her hair would cause the men around her to go mad.”
Yes, this one was seriously dished out to me by Iranian Muslim man while scolding me for dispensing with the hijab. I resisted the urge to laugh in his face and decided to give him the benefit of a doubt. So I researched about pheromones and, among other things, found out two pertinent facts: 1. pheromones are too small a molecule to be even slightly inhibited by cloth & 2. male pheromones are much stronger than those emitted by a woman so, with the aforementioned Iranian male logic, it’s men that should be covering their hair for “public safety/sanity,’ not women. But don’t do it on my account. I think it’s rather stupid and unnecessary.
Islamist trying to persuade Western women to don the hijab/chador/burqa/abaya: “Men will respect you much more if you cover yourself completely in public.”
Bullsh*za! I tried this experiment and found the very opposite true in a big way. Wanting to believe it at that point in my life in no way made it so.
A variety of Sunday school teachers and preachers when explaining why many of the esteemed prophets behaved so very badly to their fellow human beings (Noah getting drunk & inappropriate with his daughters, Lot offering his daughters for a mob to rape instead of his angelic guests, Abraham being willing to sacrifice his son and then abandoning both son and his concubine mother to die in the desert, King David’s raping, pillaging, torturing, killing, & wife stealing, etc.): “That was considered correct behavior in their time.”
I’m sure it was. It’s still not even slightly admirable. It was primitive and barbaric behavior not worthy of emulation.
Or “They were shown as an example of what not to do,” or “They repented later so God forgave them.”
Yeah right. So why did the churches when I was growing up spend so much time talking about what “illustrious lives” these men led. I just didn’t get it.
Conspiracy theorist/Flat Earther: “The moon landing was a lie! It was done at a backstage lot in Hollywood. Oh. And Columbus was very confused.”
Well, SOMEone was definitely confused. My bet is on both. *MUST KEEP STRAIGHT FACE*
Moderate Muslim trying to dissociate from the unjust brutality in Islamist terrorism and countries that practice Sharia law: “Don’t judge us by the way Believers act. Judge us by what the Koran says. What Koran says is what our religion really is.”
People make up religions. It is up to them what reputation their religion is known for.
Sympathetic Muslim trying to make sense of my leaving Islam, which totally baffles him: “If you’d studied it more, you find nothing to criticize and you’d have definitely stayed faithful to it.”
No, I’m afraid not. I got pressured into it but didn’t know nearly enough about it and was deliberately misled to about a lot of it. The more I studied it, the more I disliked it and knew it wasn’t for me. I’m sure it’s different for everyone though.
Fundamentalist Christian: “The earth is only 6,000 years old. The Bible says so and that’s all the proof I need.”
Well if it works for you, I say go for it. Doesn’t really work for me though. The basic earth science just doesn’t support it but, heck, who really knows?
Modern/moderate Muslim explaining that Muhammad’s marriage and sexual relationship with his 9-year-old wife Aisha wasn’t actually pedophilic “Because she was really 19…”
Despite this not be supported by the hadith that Aisha herself authored of having been very much a little girl when she was married… or…
“Women matured MUCH earlier then, than they do now.”
Modern muslim explaining his marriage and sexual relations with a 9-year-old: “Muhammad (PBOH) did it so it must be okay.” Then, seeing the incredulous looks or getting a flurry of outraged comments on a forum, adding, “Middle Eastern girls mature MUCH faster than Western girls do, although some Western girls do too.”
Sure. Whatever you say… just stay away from my little granddaughter or I will have you arrested and I mean it.
Bible thumper at the door: “Do you believe in Jesus Christ as your lord and savior? If you don’t, you’re going straight to Hell.”
This requires me to believe any of that. I don’t think he died for our sins but because of the sins of the people who wrongfully convicted him. I think we’re all responsible for our own sins, but that’s just my own opinion. Whatever floats your boat is just fine with me. But please don’t insult me with the Hell threats. I resent that you seem to wish that on me in revenge for not buying your line and I don’t believe that a good god would punish finite sins for an eternity; only a bad one would. But I don’t buy into the whole carrot and stick/Heaven and Hell thing. I don’t believe that’s the end-all be-all of our existence. I just don’t. Sorry.
“Woman should obey her husband in everything because Eve was made from Adams rib.”
Bite me.
“Women suffer pain in menstruation and childbirth because of her sin in biting the forbidden fruit and making Adam do the same.”
Ha! Trust me we share some of that pain with the men in our lives (poor things) and Eve did not make Adam bite that apple. He didn’t have to. He gave into temptation as surely she did.
I can understand that temptation on both parts. It was the Tree of Knowledge whatever physical thing that’s actually a term for. It had me at the “Knowledge.”
My Sunday School teacher when I asked him why humans would have been forbidden knowledge in the first place: “Because it ruined their innocence! They were intended to live as innocently as all other beasts. It would have kept their lives so much simpler!”
“But knowledge is a good thing,” I insisted. “With it, we can progress and understand and reach out for the very farthest mysteries.”
He was staring at me red-faced and flummoxed, lips tightened in a very thin line. I think he may have either hated or despaired of me in that moment.
“If I’d been Eve,” I continued, not taking his hint, “I wouldn’t even have waited for the serpent to tempt me. I’d have been tempted already. I’d have taken the apple and happily eaten it all, not even sharing it with Adam. He could get his own if he wanted it.”
“Tongue of Satan get thee behind me!” my teacher bellowed.
I cocked my head at him but let him go ahead with his lesson in peace. I could see he was getting all stressed out for some reason and I knew that couldn’t be good for his old heart.
See? I can be nice.
So could he. He’d didn’t strangle me after all and I could tell he gave it more than a passing thought on occasion.
He glared at several other students who started to raise their hands and then abruptly thought better of it.
I’m afraid I wasn’t his best student. Pretty sure I was the worst in fact. But when I went to college later, I got a perfect 4.0 GPA.
When I visited the church sometime after dropping out, he came up, all friendly, and asked what I’d been doing since I left. As soon as I told him about college, his smile vanished and he exploded at me for old times sake: “I knew it! It’s knowledge that’s corrupted you! It’ll damn you to hell if you don’t stop!”
OMG he was serious!
Anyway, whatever you believe, it isn’t necessary to convince the whole world or even your closest neighbor or family members. We all have realities we believe in. No two are exactly alike, so what’s the point of pending over backward and twisting logic all to smithereens just to convince the “opposition.” This is not a contest.
Well, to me it’s not. Guess it probably is to some people.
Sorry if I offended anyone.
Ampbreia's space 
Ampbreia, In my SOLE OPINION, I think we both let the extreme fanatic Muslims ruin us towards EVERY RELIGION. I did become somewhat brain washed into giving them the benefit of the doubt too. I wore what they called a roose a ri, did you wear those? Scarves? Anyway, I’ve ALWAYS believed in God since I was little and my parents or family weren’t religious at all. It was my idea to go to Sunday School every Sunday. Every time our preacher would say did any one want to be baptized for their sins I would go up there, he finally told me I didn’t need baptized every Sunday 🙂 🙂 Thank God he was tolerant. I didn’t necessary believe in religion, because I think that’s another form of prejudice (if your not Catholic or this denomination then the people of that denomination think your going to hell) to me that’s the judgment they say they don’t harbor…BS!
But I know God spoke to me in that camp, he told me I was going home the next night, and no one was there to tell me that, nor did I know I was going. I still believe in God with everything I have, but your right some facts are misleading. I think that is where our own common sense must prevail, if we truly believe in God. After all we were blessed with common sense amongst other things that we should know in our heart is good. For some reason I don’t hate Muslims, I don’t follow or agree with them, but don’t hate them. I will never know why, but I just know it’s right FOR ME. I respect your view and your reasons behind it, just don’t let it cloud what your heart tells you. Not your anger but your common sense and heart. I know your a very good person, if not I wouldn’t follow you like I do. Take care Deb. Lori
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I always enjoy reading about your life experiences and your thoughts. You always give me something to think about.
“This is not a contest”…this is so true!
Anytime human-kind get involved, I think religion changes, suffers, etc. It rarely resembles the way-of-life the founder had in mind at the beginning.
I’ve been on a spiritual journey of my own the past six or so years. I just wish everyone could respect those of us who don’t “believe” like they do.
GREAT post!!!
HUGS!!! 🙂
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Of course it changes. It’s like a game of telephone. Everyone interprets the message in their own way, some accidentally, and some on purpose. HUGS. I always enjoy your enjoyment so thank you! 🙂
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I hear you, A. loud and clear. in my thinking, religion is …. maybe best used as a starting point for children to give them a start in thinking about spiritual, or deeper matters. even then, though, I would rather not use religion – gets them off to a bad start. religion is based on belief, which means there is not enough burden of proof to prove it to be so. and it’s based on control of others, as you’ve shared, here.
I do care for religious people, but it’s nearly impossible to have a balanced, interesting discussion with them. I like how the Dalai Llama is directing his thinking, that it may be time to have no religion at all. he’s even considering telling his followers to no longer look for the next Dalai Llama when he dies.
I’m not sure we need religion or faith or a god to tell us what goodness and love is. people are what they are: if they are going to be good, they will use their religion for good things. if they are going to be negative, or bad, they are going to use their religion for bad purposes.
glad you shared this,
j.
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Thank you.
The Dalai Llama seems like a really good person and really clear thinker. I wish there were more like him in positions of influence. I realize that a lot of people need an authority figure to look up to, so it’s a real shame when bad people use something like religion or politics to take up such a position.
Hope you’re feeling better this evening. Doesn’t sound like you have a stuffy head at least to judge by your writing. You seem very much all there, bright eyed and bushy tailed.
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I’m trying. my eyes have this burning thing going on behind them, but my thinker is working.
religion: recently I heard about an atheistic church being started which offers the sense of community and all that, but without the dogma of religion. I wish more groups would start to do the same thing. it’s too bad that people rely on churches to do the charity work, or so it seems. I’ve often noted that churches really don’t go down to south america or africa and help people simply out of love. they don’t really want to help those people, most of the time: they want to convert them to Christianity and in the process take away their culture and make them into western consumers. they wouldn’t go down to s. america and drill wells for a town if they weren’t allowed to share their gospel, methinks.
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Uh-oh, that sounds like the beginning of pink eye. If they begin getting gunky too, then that’s a for sure. The easiest way to deal with it is wash them with baby shampoo and warm water and then rinse them with cool water. Baby shampoo won’t hurt your eyes, but it will disinfect them. I don’t think I’m using the right word there, but you know what I mean, right? The cool water will shrink the irritated swollen veins. It works pretty well.
I heard about that atheist church. It certainly is an interesting idea, though I wonder if it will develop it’s own dogma over time and end up becoming a religion like Scientology did. That wouldn’t be so good but, yeah, I hear you. It COULD be a good thing. I know a lot of people that just go to church to socialize because going to bars is their only other option off hand… or at least they tend to think so. In this day and age when so few of us actually know our neighbors, it would be nice just to have regular gatherings as a community, with no requirement at all of belonging to a particular religion or philosophy.
Foreign evangelist missions worry me; particularly in Middle Eastern countries where a person can be jailed just for owning a Bible or preaching to their neighbors. Mind you, I don’t appreciate door to door evangelists, but I don’t think its something they should be punished for like they are over there. And if they succeed in converting someone who was Muslim to Christianity? The punishment is death by staking. And a couple of weeks ago, several native Christians in Iran were sentenced to 80 lashes each just for taking communion.
Anyway… Once Upon a Time in Wonderland just came on! Good stuff!
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